Nirvana Sound

brandonwinmill

Yeah, i agree. It's like problem solving for me. If i understand how an artist gets their tone then in turn it will help me make sense of the sounds i hear in my head. I think every artist should have several tones.

lokalfuz

Definitely off topic, but why is it that most everyone who puts a clip of themselves covering Nirvana on youtube always sucks at guitar and/or has terrible rhythm?

brandonwinmill

I would guess because Kurt was an underrated rhythm guitarist. Most covers i see don't do what i said earlier. They aren't steady with the right hand, and they aren't consistently hitting open strings on the chord changes. It's real important. No matter what the left hand technique is, the right hand has to be constant.

lokalfuz

brandonwinmill said:
I would guess because Kurt was an underrated rhythm guitarist. Most covers i see don't do what i said earlier. They aren't steady with the right hand, and they aren't consistently hitting open strings on the chord changes. It's real important. No matter what the left hand technique is, the right hand has to be constant.

Agreed. It's just sort of sad that I can never find a decent video of someone covering a Nirvana song (and quite frankly, I never willingly seek to, because I know what to expect). It just seems that the kids that worship that band pick up on the raw style Cobain had, and therefor try to emulate it by just playing as aggressively as possibly, without learning the basic techniques/rhythm to become an adequate player. Cobain was raw and his songs were simple, but the guy had steady rhythm, and most of the time while playing songs wasn't bashing the hell out of his guitar with his rhythm hand. Get it straight, youtubers!

Auto-Immune

He was way underated. Rythym and lead. I wish I could solo like him or at all.

brandonwinmill

Yep. He moved modes sometimes when he soloed. Just take notes out of the chords and voice the vocal melody with those notes on the guitar. Then use passing notes also that aren't in the chords to accent certain parts. Sharpen or flatten a note real fast or hammer on like a vibrato in your voice. Show emotions through sound, just like singing. Sounds easy right...it isn't! Everyone has their own style and i find each persons way of soloing is a mixture of their own influences. You can certainly hear a lot of kurt in my rare soloing. (not as good as him of course) But you can also hear some of the cure and a touch of everything i like. I like minor pentatonic scales so i usually look there and see if i can find the melody and if it isn't too hard in that position. Then you might hear some beatles and probably chuck berry. I try to sometimes write parts on the guitar that sound like organ parts you might hear in the doors. I like blues style piano runs and pedal steel licks also. Add it all together and it makes it me.

Think about what you like, and roll with it. Trust your ears and play with confidence. The only wrong way is to not try! Most people think they suck at soloing.

Auto-Immune

I do try. Ive been playing for 6 years and i still cant solo. Everyone says practice scales but i dont understand how playing a scale ov er and over help you with soloing like how do you know when to play which notes and how do you improvise. Also, i cant get my fingers to move that fast. Sorry for being naiive I just want to get better and dont know how people have given me suggestions and they just dont work

spirograph

Auto-Immune said:
Also, i cant get my fingers to move that fast.

dont obsess about playing fast. when you play, focus on playing every note clearly. perfect being able to make any note sound how you want. work on subtlety of dynamics. and then one day soon youll amaze yourself with your speed.

brandonwinmill

Did what i said make sense? You want to pull the notes for the solo out of the chords you are using. Then it's like you are playing the vocal melody using only single notes. The song i just posted the other day in the singing problems thread is an example of simple soloing. The first time i did a little solo i used the root note of each chord on the a string. Then i played the same notes in a different spot that was way higher and it was on the b string. Then when i mixed it, i put them on top of each other the second time and made the harmonized part. You can use 3rds or 5ths and do the same thing.

Here is another thing i did. I think the music i wrote was in c. I actually sang in f#. I didn't know what key my voice was in and i probably should have figured that out first but i was way too far along to start over. Anyways, if you don't know relative minor's all you have to do is look it up. So, the relative minor of c is aminor. It isn't very difficult. The relative minor means that c and aminor share all the same notes except they start on different notes. Obviously c major would start on c. C would therefore be the one and d the two and so on. In aminor a would be the one and b the two and so on. So basically, c is the only major key to have no flats or sharps and aminor would be the same. Next i pulled up aminor pentatonic scale and looked at it. I played it several times fast just to hear the notes. Then i went back and started playing it slower and playing it in random order but i started letting some notes ring longer. Once i found some notes in that scale that i thought sounded nice i started singing in my mind. I sang the song and held the note for the length of each syllable. When the pitch of my voice went up or down then i mimicked it with the guitar until it started echoing what i was singing. At this point i started adding more syllables. Sometimes i would only play the last two or three words. Sometimes i would answer with the guitar. I think that is called call and response. Kurt did that a bit also.

I think you may be trying too hard. Don't go into thinking it has to be fancy or fast. I hate fast. My favorite solos aren't fast at all. They are classy and they match the song and they all have a great tone. I'm way more into David Gilmour than yngwie. If you try to articulate through the guitar then you will be fine. Grab come as you are at the 2 minute mark and you can hear exactly what i'm saying. Kurt starts singing the melody through his guitar. It isn't fast or fancy but it's good! You can do this, don't over complicate it. The song i'm doing next will be about courtney but i'm going to intentionally try and sound like Kurt. The solo will be very similar to something he would have done.

brandonwinmill

This web page is a huge help to me. The reverse chords especially. You just click what you are holding and it tells you the chord name. I also use the arpeggio section. It is so helpful! That is how i write on other instruments. I go to that part and just click the chord name and it gives me variations (major 7th, sus4, and so on) that i can use in conjunction with the guitar parts. You may know the page already, if so disregard. It might help someone though. It also has every scale you can think of and some i didn't even know existed. Very resourceful!

here ya go:

http://www.all-guitar-chords.com/chord_name.php

brandonwinmill

You know what pisses me off? When somebody can't take their own #### advice! I know how to emulate Kurt. For sure. I can explain how to properly emulate Kurt to someone who is a skilled guitarist. Why the hell can't i do what i said to do? Man, its frustrating. I can't keep it steady when i'm adding these 16th note mutes into a riff that is slower than that. It's like, umm, jerky, i guess. Unnatural may be a better word. Off time may be another. I have these hitches that won't line up in time and i'm almost over this cold so i can sing. I do not want to spend 6 mths on another song. I need to sound like him in this one song to make sure i get my point across. It's perfect because i really like Kurt and this would be an acceptable situation to copy his sound and style. I might have to cut it up on a computer to make it work and i needed it to feel live. I really wanted it to sound like it could have been on a nirvana album. I've spent a lot of time researching in order to find the right words that both kurt and courtney may have used. Actually, the solo's are good! I'm happy with them as they are. I just need to get the rhythm sorted out. Once i do that then i can lay the big distorted bends and all the feedback over the rhythm in some spots. More importantly, i can't write drums to this rhythm. See, this is where not having a real living and breathing drummer and bass player is going to really hurt me. I was able to pull it off in the last one, but this isn't as easy by a mile. On the bright side the tone is right! ha! I may need help on this one. Most of my musician friends are either on tour or in studio for about a mth. I'm not one to wait so if anyone plays drums or bass maybe you could make suggestions. I'm hoping maybe the time signature i'm using isn't correct or an easy fix like that. I can upload the lick a few different times and if anyone can help. If i have to change it then i have to do it. The concept of the song is awesome and even the title is perfect! thanks

brandonwinmill

wow. what a difference one day makes. i got it. it's going to be perfect. the only setback is no bass. people don't give krist enough credit. big part of their sound was bass. hopefully i can pull this off without a bass. it just wasn't working. i'm excited about this song! almost done. maybe a week and i'll upload it. if you dislike courtney or think that she ruined him, then you will like it. if you think kurt just imploded and had trouble with fame and a child and his stupid wife, then you still might like it. i think it was both, but i put more on her. i do think she wanted him dead instead of clean and retired. we'll probably never know what really happened. too bad he's gone. he would have liked this song! ftw

brandonwinmill

Auto-Immune said:
I do try. Ive been playing for 6 years and i still cant solo. Everyone says practice scales but i dont understand how playing a scale ov er and over help you with soloing like how do you know when to play which notes and how do you improvise. Also, i cant get my fingers to move that fast. Sorry for being naiive I just want to get better and dont know how people have given me suggestions and they just dont work

They do work. Here is the last suggestion you need, play with CONFIDENCE! Am i going to have to tell you about the little engine that could...

I--think--I--can, I--think--I--can!!

You should play the solo...

can you record yourself? I can let you hear it when it's almost done and you can play a bit and i'll put it on there and make it work. you'll probably be surprised what we can do and how it sounds in context. I don't want fast. I want to hear every note sing. I'll bet money it will sound perfect!

That goes for anyone else also. We've done this before, where we all add some stuff. It's worked out well in the past. I have the basic melody done and the chords. The vocal melody is basically done also. I just need to pick which lyrics fit in there better and sing it. I want it to be short. People quit listening after 3 minutes anyways.

Auto-Immune

Thanks guys. Is it better to learn by playing covers? Or just messing around by yourself?

spirograph

Auto-Immune said:
Thanks guys. Is it better to learn by playing covers? Or just messing around by yourself?

both. just play as much as you can. i try to keep a guitar in my hands as much as possible, just to keep my fingers moving. gotta be good for the ear too. i play guitar whilst reading, whilst watchin a film, whenever i can. i keep a guitar next to my bed. used to wake up hugging it nearly every day.

brandonwinmill

So this means you are going to play a solo right?

Here is what i think. If you heard a solo you played actually in a song then it would open your eyes. Sitting there playing a solo by yourself won't give you much self gratification. When you hear it with other stuff then it will be an eye opener for you. It will seem much more simple. A lot of solos that you hear on records are from multiple sessions and pieced together by an engineer. You wouldn't believe how many are done that way. Some of them are actually in a different tuning. So half the solo is obviously from another guitar and another take and sometimes a completely different player. That is probably why live is different usually. If you don't have confidence in your playing then no one else will either. In other words, play it like you own it. It's 75% attitude. Don't be afraid to let loose. Your solo is a chance to speak through your guitar and that is why phrasing is way more important than speed. You can do this if you think you can. Good Luck.

Auto-Immune

brandonwinmill said:
So this means you are going to play a solo right?
Here is what i think. If you heard a solo you played actually in a song then it would open your eyes. Sitting there playing a solo by yourself won't give you much self gratification. When you hear it with other stuff then it will be an eye opener for you. It will seem much more simple. A lot of solos that you hear on records are from multiple sessions and pieced together by an engineer. You wouldn't believe how many are done that way. Some of them are actually in a different tuning. So half the solo is obviously from another guitar and another take and sometimes a completely different player. That is probably why live is different usually. If you don't have confidence in your playing then no one else will either. In other words, play it like you own it. It's 75% attitude. Don't be afraid to let loose. Your solo is a chance to speak through your guitar and that is why phrasing is way more important than speed. You can do this if you think you can. Good Luck.

I know what you mean. In the song "stain" by Nirvana you can distinctly hear 2 guitars during the solo..Well that makes me feel better I'll give it a shot

Auto-Immune

spirograph said:
both. just play as much as you can. i try to keep a guitar in my hands as much as possible, just to keep my fingers moving. gotta be good for the ear too. i play guitar whilst reading, whilst watchin a film, whenever i can. i keep a guitar next to my bed. used to wake up hugging it nearly every day.

I've been taking your advice and whenever I'm not working or sleeping I'm trying to practise

spirograph

Auto-Immune said:
I've been taking your advice and whenever I'm not working or sleeping I'm trying to practise

good stuff! the other thing that makes quite a difference: PLAY FROM YOUR HIPS!!! put a lot of sex into your playing, and people will get more turned on by it. like badmotorfinger said, confidence is a massive part of it (id say more than 75%!). but anyway, music is about sex, ultimately. cant remember the quote exactly, but some famous poet said that dancing is a vertical expression of a horizontal desire. its the same with music too. whenever im writing, i ask myself, "can you f**k to this?". if the answer is 'yes' then i keep going with it. if not, then something needs changin.

brandonwinmill

I'm going to start singing tonight. I'm going to try and sing through my guitar chain. I'll switch guitar and mic and leave everything the same. It probably won't work and a mesa boogie amp wasn't designed to sing through but i don't care. It's worth a shot. If anyone wants to sing harmonies then that would be awesome too. I'm intentionally hijacking Kurt's sound, writing style, the whole thing. This obviously is not going to be anything i actually release or i'll have to pay courtney and that ain't happening. The title is court me, love! ha! My wife came up with the title and it fits perfect! The lyrics are almost done and i have the intro and the chorus already written and tracked and most of the drums. I'm finishing the verse's and then i'll write a rhythm part for that and i think i already know how it's going to flow and then i'll upload it and we can solo all over it! It doesn't matter what it sounds like. It's going to work, i'll make it work. Once i get a rough draft uploaded then whoever wants to add something can. I'm not a singer but i'm not scared either. I'll try. If it's real bad i'll auto-tune it or just scream until i throw up my vocal chords! Sounds like fun! ha!

« Previous Page Next Page »