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wow, prepare to weep! It will break your heart!


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that..... *sigh*

but

"Q: oooh that things a piece..ogaboogabooga

A: YES IT IS... ITS A PIECE OF...................ART!!! BELIEVE IT OR NOT IT ACTUALLY FEELS GREAT!!! SOME THINGS ARE SIMPLY JUST FUN... "

i loled

also, WTF is with the headstock...

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In 40 years time when my Jagmaster and 51 are "vintage", I wonder if people will be whining about how I have butchered them...

But seriously, that guitar is just hideous.

And gotta agree with McCon, it does look like a pickguard.

Oh, by the way, how old DOES a guitar have to be to be "vintage"? When I look for MIM Duo's they are usually referred to as being vintage...

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I think the terms vintage and rare should be taken with a grain of salt on Ebay, I see people calling Japanese Fender Jaguars made only a few years ago "vintage", and getting the models wrong...

EBAY-MOMENT

"I gotz dis Vintage 2007 Fender Jazzmaster made in Japan and handcrafted in the usa by these elves. The Elves models were rare, you can tell by the elves sticker on the back of the neckplate. And look at all that mojo, I think Courtney Love played this guitar with Son House and Blind Melon Chitlin at the hoopajoob club in 1934. Starting big is $10,959.00 and shipping and handling will be $105.99 to all places in the lower 48 states."

(insert shameless company plug and mission statement here)

ENG OF EBAY MOMENT

As for the Mustang, I can see how this kind of stuff happened, I don't like it, but I know why. Back when Mustangs were cheap, the kids with them could not afford anything more expensive (or were too impaitient to save up for what they wanted), so they would take the Mustangs and so fourth their parents bought them, rip em' up, put alll the latest mods on them, and then use them for awhile before selling them off when they realized how stupid they are being....here's an example of a life of one of those gutars....

The lifecycle of a Vintage Mustang

- Some guy buys the guitar in 1966, lovingly plays it for about 5-10 years, and sells it off

- In the 70's, a punk rocker gets his hands on it, punks it out with stickers and a humbucker

- Ah, the 80's, guitar is sold to a pawn shop and sold to some high school kid for $50, he proceeds to replace the stickers and damaged olympic white with a rattlecan wannabe EVH paintjob and sticks on a Kahler trem.

- Late 80's....everybody wants something wacky shaped, so said kid cuts the body up in 4 or five places to make it look less "round", more like a Dean or a Jackson, guitar now barely resembles a Mustang, has 2 EMG pickups in it, and is painted black with skull and crossbones across the back.

- 1990's - Guitar is bought up by a guitar shop for $20 after kid can't make the light bill. Guitar store has another Mustang body sitting out back, so their wizard technician reuses the original neck and throws it onto another body with bits off the other Mustang.

- Still 1990's - Guitar is bought for $500 as an "original vintage Mustang", 12 year old Nirvana fanboy decides he wants a Seymour Duncan JB to be just like his idol, Kurt Cobain.

- 2000's - Guitar winds up in a prestigious shop, with a vintage guitar nut who likes Mustangs for the cult status they have (because it = $$$$$). He strips the finish, filles in the cavity for the humbucker (or not), repaints the guitar Reranch Sonic Blue, and sells it to $4300 to some sucker passing it off as a rare vintage instrument.

So yeah, you can see that I'm a tad jaded when it comes to the whole vintage collector/modified thing. I pretty much assume all vintage guitars have been tampered with to some degree, unless I'm given good reason to believe not.

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I think the terms vintage and rare should be taken with a grain of salt on Ebay, I see people calling Japanese Fender Jaguars made only a few years ago "vintage", and getting the models wrong...

EBAY-MOMENT

"I gotz dis Vintage 2007 Fender Jazzmaster made in Japan and handcrafted in the usa by these elves. The Elves models were rare, you can tell by the elves sticker on the back of the neckplate. And look at all that mojo, I think Courtney Love played this guitar with Son House and Blind Melon Chitlin at the hoopajoob club in 1934. Starting big is $10,959.00 and shipping and handling will be $105.99 to all places in the lower 48 states."

(insert shameless company plug and mission statement here)

ENG OF EBAY MOMENT

As for the Mustang, I can see how this kind of stuff happened, I don't like it, but I know why. Back when Mustangs were cheap, the kids with them could not afford anything more expensive (or were too impaitient to save up for what they wanted), so they would take the Mustangs and so fourth their parents bought them, rip em' up, put alll the latest mods on them, and then use them for awhile before selling them off when they realized how stupid they are being....here's an example of a life of one of those gutars....

The lifecycle of a Vintage Mustang

- Some guy buys the guitar in 1966, lovingly plays it for about 5-10 years, and sells it off

- In the 70's, a punk rocker gets his hands on it, punks it out with stickers and a humbucker

- Ah, the 80's, guitar is sold to a pawn shop and sold to some high school kid for $50, he proceeds to replace the stickers and damaged olympic white with a rattlecan wannabe EVH paintjob and sticks on a Kahler trem.

- Late 80's....everybody wants something wacky shaped, so said kid cuts the body up in 4 or five places to make it look less "round", more like a Dean or a Jackson, guitar now barely resembles a Mustang, has 2 EMG pickups in it, and is painted black with skull and crossbones across the back.

- 1990's - Guitar is bought up by a guitar shop for $20 after kid can't make the light bill. Guitar store has another Mustang body sitting out back, so their wizard technician reuses the original neck and throws it onto another body with bits off the other Mustang.

- Still 1990's - Guitar is bought for $500 as an "original vintage Mustang", 12 year old Nirvana fanboy decides he wants a Seymour Duncan JB to be just like his idol, Kurt Cobain.

- 2000's - Guitar winds up in a prestigious shop, with a vintage guitar nut who likes Mustangs for the cult status they have (because it = $$$$$). He strips the finish, filles in the cavity for the humbucker (or not), repaints the guitar Reranch Sonic Blue, and sells it to $4300 to some sucker passing it off as a rare vintage instrument.

So yeah, you can see that I'm a tad jaded when it comes to the whole vintage collector/modified thing. I pretty much assume all vintage guitars have been tampered with to some degree, unless I'm given good reason to believe not.

You're like a constant downer, huh? No, I'm just kidding.

Anyways, about the guitar... :cry:

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in the lower 48 states...

WTF is with that?? I mean, you got like 3000 miles, is Maine really that hard to get to??

Why is it that British people know American geography, but Americans don't know a thing about British geography? ...or is it just me?

Well here's a lesson.

North = Sheffield = Bad

South = Devon = good

:wink:

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in the lower 48 states...

WTF is with that?? I mean, you got like 3000 miles, is Maine really that hard to get to??

It is lower 48, the 2 states missing are Hawaii and Alaska. I was trying to add some of the typical stuff I read in E-bay ads about shipping. Hawaii is practically an island, and Alaska is far off the beaten' path and has limited access.

I could go off about our pathetic school system and awful parenting problem here, but I feel it's too political for this forum.

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In 40 years time when my Jagmaster and 51 are "vintage", I wonder if people will be whining about how I have butchered them...

Oh, by the way, how old DOES a guitar have to be to be "vintage"? When I look for MIM Duo's they are usually referred to as being vintage...

For Fender its the 1965 Pre-CBS guitars are considered the true Vintage collectibles. The quality of Fender made guitars suffered greatly when bean counters of corporate america took over. Production was streamlined for mass production and a lot of old style craftsmanship was lost. As they were always in the looking for ways to cut cost and maximize profits. They replaced the Nitro-Cellulose in favor of Polyurethane paint. Brazilian Rosewood fretboard was replaced with Indian Rosewood.

There is a myth than Vintage guitars are better than a new guitar isn't true. A well built guitar today from Fender is considered as good or better than an old vintage model.

The only subtle difference you would be:

1. Wood is a living material. Its tone could only improves it ages. IF its was a good tone wood to begin with AND is well taken care of.

2. Vintage Pickups are valued as being the gold standard reference for tone and rarity. But that doesn't mean today's after market PAF, P90's, Mini Humbuckers and Single coils aren't as good as the original vintage models. As long as Seymoure Duncan, Dimarzio, Lindy Fralin, Kinman or any other boutique pickup can get an authentic vintage pickup as reference. They can reverse engineer and make new ones. In fact they even gone further and made improved versions of the originals.

AFAIK the only authentic vintage pickup design that you couldn't buy brand new from anybody is the Fender Wide Range Humbuckers. Since they cant (or wont) source CuNiFer magnets. I have no idea if Lee Renaldo's signature Jazzmaster FWR pickups is really CuNiFer. If it is Fender isn't selling it to the public.

As for today's MIM Jagmaster or MIJ Vista model. It could be today's overpriced vintage Mustang. When the next big breakthrough rockstar thing comes along. So better hang on with that guitar and wait. You may strike it rich. =)

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1. Wood is a living material. Its tone could only improves it ages.

I don't doubt that this is true, but I always wondered WHY it is so. What makes aged wood sound better than newer wood? Has it been scientifically validated? Personally, I'm still on the fence about how much difference body wood makes to bolt-on neck at all.

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to not get into an argument about the state of the american education system; during my recent trip to numerous places in america, i found the clever people to be very knowledgebale about their history (especially about the claim of inpedendance in was it 1776?). However, their knowledge of news or anything outside of their country could be like it just doesn't exist. This could be perhaps because Americans learn about their own history, whereas schools in England learn about so much more, maybe because their is more to learn because of the British Colonies and the 2 World Wars and the French revolution etc.etc.etc. becuase we're in Europe we get interested in the countries around us too as they are so different.

People outside America sometimes call americans dumb or stupid, but i think this is wrong, i just think most americans don;t experiance life outside their own country, or even their own state!

Americans are very different to British people, so subtly different that it makes a real difference.

i apoligise if i've caused anyone any offence, its taken me an age to type this and its late so my spelling and grammer aint too good

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Only in America could Illinois be referred to as "midwest".

Well we can't call it the middle east.

Haha, touche' :lol:

People outside America sometimes call americans dumb or stupid, but i think this is wrong, i just think most americans don;t experiance life outside their own country, or even their own state!

I think what you're referring to there, Mr Ish, is the difference between stupidity and ignorance.

Frank Zappa once said that stupidity is the building block of the universe, because it is the most abundant element. I tend to think ignorance is more prevalent than stupidity :) I'm a little more kind than Zappa.

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Stupidity = Not learning/heeding what is easily known to be true.

Igjnorance = Making an assumption based off of experience or not-so-clear circumstances

However, there is a catch, that as soon as one knows they are ignorant to the circumstance, and they don't heed the responsibility to learn, then they are truly being stupid.

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1. Wood is a living material. Its tone could only improves it ages.

I don't doubt that this is true, but I always wondered WHY it is so. What makes aged wood sound better than newer wood? Has it been scientifically validated? Personally, I'm still on the fence about how much difference body wood makes to bolt-on neck at all.

A professional luthier would be able to answer that question with authority. I can only try.

A quality builders would always prefer 150 year old growth tree's for tone woods, discarding young lumbers often used for build houses or furniture. Aside from sourcing the wood. It also goes thru a drying process to remove moisture. Aside from the factory production run. Builders would stockpile high quality tone woods and build a limited run NOS guitars from them. Sort of like a winemaker stocking up the best "Reserve" wine for himself and occasionally selling them. So they could charge a premium for quality in marketing speak.

Bolt on body and necks are just different design from set-neck or neck-thru guitars. A bolt on guitar body can have 2 to 3 wood pieces glued in together to form 1 block. So there is a premium charged for a single piece wood body. If you think about it. You'll need a very old tree wide enough to cover the whole Strat body.

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